Aliaa Remtilla - Following Your Heart’s Desire

In today’s episode, I sit down with Alia, a daughter of immigrants who navigated her way from Canada to Harvard to PhD in anthropology, and who now coaches high achievers to balance their careers with their true desires. Tune in to hear how following your heart can lead to extraordinary transformation.

Bio

Aliaa is a life coach, published author & startup founder, who is known for her ability to take academic insights and translate them into practical applications - such as coaching. Her long list of accomplishments include:
• Being recruited to play NCAA Div 1 field hockey at Harvard.
• Social Anthropology PhD. Conducted research in 20+ countries.
• Expert in identity work with historically marginalized adults (18+).
• As a non-profit Exec, managed 600+ people across 3 countries.
• Raised ~$1M as Co-Founder of VC-backed startup, StoryTiling.
• Author of a book. Filmmaker. Board Member. Keynote speaker.
Aliaa’s unique superpower as a coach is her intelligence, ability to read people, and cut straight to the point. She’s able to make the smartest people feel seen, supported and productively challenged. Read more about Aliaa at aliaaremtilla.com and connect with her on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/aliaa-remtilla/

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Access free resources and learn more about Sheila and her team at Signet Education at signeteducation.com or on LinkedIn at https://www.linkedin.com/in/sheilaakbar/.

Transcript

Aliaa Remtilla: 0:00

It's this question of, How am I fully living my heart's desire, but also fully living what I want from this moment? And honestly, that's the bit that's never changed, that was a core skill that I acquired. And so yeah, sure, it might look like twists and turns, but it's just a deep, deep commitment to doing what my heart desires, and then having the confidence that if I desire, whatever I desire, I will do I can do, and I will excel at

Sheila Akbar: 0:50

Hi, folks, we have made it to the last episode of the year. I am quite looking forward to winding down 2024 and kind of cocooning up for the next couple of weeks, preparing ourselves for 2025 I think today's guest is a great one to go out on. It's my friend Alia remtilla, who is a scholar, a producer, an entrepreneur, a lifelong learner, just a really fun person to talk to, and she is a coach of high achieving individuals and helps them follow their heart's desire, which you'll hear us talking about on the episode quite a bit. And I will say I sort of followed my heart's desire in the course of this conversation, and got really in the weeds with her on some things that may seem like a little bit of a distraction, but I found them so fascinating. So I hope you'll feel the same way. Take a listen. I'll see you on the other side. So Alia, thank you so much for joining me. Well, thanks for having me excited about the conversation. It's really nice to be able to have old friends on and even though you know, we didn't know each other all that well when we first met, and we're interacting a little more regularly. It does feel like we are old friends, and every time I see you posting something about your journey into adulthood, I'm like, Are we the same person? Obviously, there are major differences, but there's so much similarity in some of the you know, realizations we've had and experiences we've had that have shaped who we are now and how we work with other people. So I'm really excited to have you on and have people hear a little bit more about your story. So why don't we start there, tell us about how you grew up and where and then how your educational journey started shaping up? Yeah, sure. Thanks for having me excited to have this conversation with you as well. So I am from Vancouver, Canada, which you would think is super close to the United States, but where it comes to like university admissions, might as well be on a different planet, because everything is different here. I was born here, but my parents and my parents, you know, actually met in Vancouver, but they were both born in Tanzania, third generation East Africans. So a lot of my childhood being born like, you know, maybe less than a decade after they'd moved here, was part of that in between generation, right? So a lot of my upbringing was navigating what it means to be the first generation born in Canada, what it meant to be brown in the 80s and 90s, figuring out who I was at a time when it was our generation that was negotiating all of this and figuring out, how can we be all of the different things that made us who who we are. And it's, you know, we use the word intersectionality these days, and it can be more more appropriate for, I think, that experience and one of the key principles that was really driven into us was the value of education. And it was this idea that you never stopped staying until you got your PhD, which I took a little bit to literally, I think eventually get that. But you know, it was education just really matter. And education was the pathway to the future, a pathway for success, and I very uncritically accepted that, yeah, well, you know, similarities abound, of course, and I'm curious. For me, I like search my memory, and I've even talked to my parents about this and and I don't think I can hone in on a time where they were like, you must have all A's. You must be the best. You know, I don't think any of that was explicit, but it was somehow communicated to me and my brother that those were the things that were expected of us, and it wasn't like, I mean, I didn't ever get a B, so I don't know how my parents would have reacted if I brought home.

Unknown: 5:00

Less than an A but you know, it wasn't that I was scared into that. And again, I don't think it was explicitly said. But how was that? How was that presented to you as you were growing up? I remember a conversation with my father where he actually taught me the importance of like, strategic excellence. Say more. I want to hear about this. So essentially what we sat down and we had this conversation, and like, at the time, like cut off for sciences was, like the low 90s for the average, and you kind of needed so a 90% was an A plus, right? So, and then you knew, and it was grade 910, 1112, that would go for US universities, and just grade 12 for Canadian and so there was this one day, and I was in a very competitive school. So it wasn't just from the house, it was, it was at a private all girls school, 73 girls, you know, very, very competitive. And I was in all the AP classes that you could take. And it was, it wasn't the most supportive environment, right? There was a lot of bullying. And I remember, like, my instance, like, was I came in, and I think I like, the provincial tests results were standardized. Provincial tests had been announced, and this one girl comes into the room and she goes, haha, I got higher than you. I got 96 and you got 95 in front of the whole class, right? So it was this kind of horrific dynamic where everyone was trying to beat me, and then you just like, I mean, clearly, like, No, I don't want you to beat me. And by that point, what was really interesting about that moment was that this was after this conversation I'd had with my dad, and when she said that, I just kind of laughed and was like, but I didn't study, like, I actually didn't care. And the conversation, and I didn't say anything. I just kind of, you know, thank God I wasn't that mean, I think I was just so shocked. But yeah, that was the most So, so the conversation I'd had with my dad, I remember we were driving to field hockey practice, like, I vividly remember this moment, and I was like, you know, I think I'd gotten a 98 or a 99 on a math test. And I was like, so annoyed I didn't get the 100. And dad was like, Ali, I like, why does it matter? And he was like, what do you need? Like, what do you actually need marks wise? And that's where I was like, Well, I guess I need, like, maybe a 9093 to give me some buffer if I want to go to a Canadian university, and honestly, to get to an American university, 89.5 is fine, because there's no difference between 89.5 gets around to 90. I get my a plus. They're not going to know the difference between that and 100

Aliaa Remtilla: 7:34

and so he was like, So then why are you trying for more? I was like, Oh, really. What an enlightened conversation. That was amazing, right? And so he was like, Yeah, but, like, that's all that matters. So that's all you strive for. So I was like, but then I don't need to study for that. Like, that's just, if I listen in class and do my homework, I'll get that. So he's like, so don't study amazing. And so then, yeah, so that was, for me, quite a thing, right? And then, and that changed everything. So then from there on, I just joined every extracurricular there was possible. I played field hockey a lot, like Wednesdays. I was on three different teams, and, like, you know, I volunteered, and I come home at like, 8pm and, you know, just wasn't about school all the time anymore. So you you did all of these other things because you had time sort of freed up when you realized you didn't have to work so hard to get the grades you needed at school. Yeah. I mean, like, the biggest fights in our house were not about school or about studying, right? The biggest fights in our house were mom and dad wanting me to do, to like, go to Jamaat Khanna, which is a religious community, place of worship on a day when I had feel healthy practice or a game at the same time, those were the big disagreements in our house. And how did you choose what extracurriculars to join, like, So good question, How did field hockey come into your life? Because I know that was a big part of everything for you. Field Hockey was huge for me. I mean, it's how I got recruited, so like that. It got me into Harvard. It gave me my my education. Field Hockey started by like, you know, we all have those, like, cool, older people that you look up to. And my parents had adopted these two twin girls women, and I just always wanted to do everything like them, and they played field hockey. So as soon as I got older, I was like, Hey, this is what I want to do. I think the other thing for me with the extracurriculars was because I struggled socially. So, like, I was really good friends with my field hockey teammates, but no one else at school in my grade played field hockey. And so like, I didn't know what to do with my breaks and lunches, and so I joined. I just made sure I had a club to do every lunchtime so I didn't need to figure out who to sit with. And that was actually why I was so well rounded. And. And ended up winning this, like, scholarship in grade 12 for being the most all around in person. But like, really, I just needed someone to eat lunch with amazing. It's so funny how, like, some force in our life, you know, gets us to do the thing that actually leads us to some, you know, some kind of success. For me, it was I lived about 40 minutes from school, and my parents were very strict about who I could hang out with and what I could do after school, so I knew that if I just got involved in a lot of extracurriculars, even if they weren't all like right back to back, I would have an excuse to stay out of the house and not come all the way back home. And so I would like hang out with friends at Barnes and Noble was the place that we would go hang out. Love it the bowling alley, or we just like, hang out, you know, while our friends had whatever sport practice like, we just like, hang out, watch them. But it was the only way I could be social was to be at a house, because once I got home, it was so far away and my parents weren't gonna let me out. So I got involved in, like, literally everything. And then, you know, when it came time for college applications, it was like, Oh, look, she's done everything, and she leads every club. And it wasn't because I was like, you know, trying to claw above the competition or anything like that. It was just like, I didn't want to go home. So here I am. There you are. That's very interesting. Okay, so you play field hockey, you get recruited to Harvard. Tell us about that experience. Yeah, once again, this is where the whole Canada thing, like, was a big part of my experience, just because getting into an American university was like, how do you do that? Like, I was lucky that I was at this private school where there was a guidance counselor who kind of knew the pathway, but she'd never had someone get recruited before. So it was this, like, so funny, so and, and the other thing I don't know if, like, any of the people who are listening to this have ever experienced this, but like, my parents had never heard of Princeton, ever, or like any other Ivy League, right? So all they'd ever heard of were Harvard or Stanford. And so when I was growing up, it was okay, you stay at home and go to the local university, UBC, which had an amazing field hockey team, and you know, that was kind of presumed, or you can go to Harvard or Stanford, and that's it, right? But if you're gonna leave home and take all of that, it's gonna be for those schools. Now, at the time, Princeton had one of the best field hockey teams, and I had a woman, oh, there was a woman who I played field hockey with who had gone to Princeton and had kind of sold me on it. So Princeton is where I wanted to go, and my dad, and clearly you're going to get the sense that he's just like, very, very sophisticated man, right? So he goes, Okay, I need to see Princeton to know if it's like, to really get a sense, because, like, you're telling me all this stuff, but I need to see it for myself, and I want you to go see Harvard. So he's like, let's fly out and let's go take a look. Now, once again, Canada, right? So this is like, way back before early commits didn't exist then. So this is August, end of August, before my grade 12 year. This is how late this is all happening. I'd written the SATs once, and I'd written my SAT twos once, and they were like, find scores. But I wasn't that impressed, and I was intending to rewrite them. So we fly out. We go to Harvard. First, I go to the admissions officer briefing the guy, I ask a question about how much they pay attention to SAT marks for Canadians. And the guy goes, where in Canada are you from? And I say, Vancouver. He says, What school do you go to? Gave him my school? And he's like, I'm going to be reading your application. And I was like, what? He's like, come talk to me after. So I go and talk to him afterwards. And I was like, Look, I play field hockey. I'm interested in and he was like, What position do you place? And I'm a goalie. He said they're looking for a goalie. Go over and say, hi, wow. They were a train season. And I was like, really? And he's like, so this is, like, back then they didn't even know how to recruit Canadians, right? Like, it was a while ago, yeah. So I crossed the bridge to Harvard to the field hockey thing, and they happened to be practicing. So we show up in the stands, the assistant coach walks out and is like, this is a closed practice. What are you doing here? And I'm like, Oh, I'm a field hockey bully from Canada, and I just was told to come over and say hi. She was like, yes, okay, hold on, let's finish the practice. Can you just wait? So I talked to her, she gets my grades, she gets my GPA, basically, she gets my SAT scores, writes them all down on this little piece of paper I still remember. And she's like, send us video. And then they invited me for the like, you know, the weekend trip. And they're like, Yeah, you're on our top five. So the time field hockey is a team of 20. So they got a team of five people their top five. If you applied early, we're basically going to get in if you met basic criteria, right? So they're like, you're in our top five. We want to. Fly you out for, I don't know what it was, some weekend. And I was like, You're kidding, right? Like, you're a field hockey team, and you're asking me to miss my weekend games for this. Like, do you understand how field like, no. So I just refused. I was like, I'm I'm not gonna miss field hockey for, like, what seems social, like, I know I want to go there. You know you want to go. You want me. So what is there left to discuss? And they were like, I don't think that never happened to

Unknown: 15:29

them. We're paying for it. I'm like, Yeah, but that's not the problem. Oh, my God, so I got in

Sheila Akbar: 15:42

that's amazing. That is so amazing. How are like, I want to call it teenage hubris.

Unknown: 15:51

Really served you random value systems, right, right? And then, like mom and dad, you wanted me to skip to go Connie, I'm not even skipping like a free trip to Harvard. Yeah,

Aliaa Remtilla: 16:05

that's amazing. That is so amazing. Oh, my God, okay, let's fast forward a little bit. So you studied, I want to say anthropology. My patients in anthropology, I actually kept putting the film through my under Oh, okay, I did film in Islamic Studies, yeah. What was the goal? There yet, 911 happened the night before my first day of classes. So it was like after preseason before the first night of classes. It hadn't come out that I was a Muslim, and I barely even understood what that meant, because and then, like, the dynamic change. So basically every class that I could take on, you know, just trying to figure out who I was. So a lot of my undergrad was a lot of that kind of sort of soul searching to figure out, like, what that meant. Yeah, that resonates so much. So the idea was to make film about Muslims. Like, what was the I mean, a lot of it was identity exploration. So my style was, so this is like, just as blogs were becoming popular, webcams didn't exist then. And I started, I think webcams started my senior year, and I started talking to a camera, which was very unusual for the time, and it was like confessional style. So it was, and I think at the time it was this, like, so a lot of my undergrad was just about, who am I, right? And my films kind of explored that in a very once again, like, so not appropriate in our cultural background,

Unknown: 17:32

pre social media, pre, like, all of this stuff. So now you look at my stuff and you're like, Oh, this is like, yeah, it predates the selfie, and it like, yeah, you're so ahead of your time looking except now I don't have text like, I don't use social media, I think because, like, at the time again, this are ahead of your time. I've been there, done that, I learned my lessons. Yeah.

Aliaa Remtilla: 17:59

Okay. And then after college, I know that's when you started your more academic, further academics, yeah, yeah. So I took a year, and I think for that year, that was like, I don't know what I really want to be doing. So I spent half year in Thailand, half year in Sri Lanka before that. And then while I was in Thailand, I realized that, like, I was spending, I was living in a rural village, teaching English at a government school, and realized that I was spending most of my time reading academic books, and I still hadn't finished with like, where I what I needed to do in terms of personal discovery, but from, like, a very intellectual lens, and I thinking back to all the classes that I had taken on the study of Islam in my undergrad, the lens that I appreciated the most was the anthropological lens, and so that's what I decided would be the so I needed a master's to convert to anthropology. I still wanted to keep the film, so my PhD was part written, part film, and a degree in anthropology. So I lived for my PhD research on the Tajik Afghan border, and was really interested. It's like it's a morality, right? So ethics, morality, religion. So the intersection of religion, economics and politics, and looking at how people were making sense of the perceived immorality of capitalism in the post Soviet context, right? So what does it mean to have to make profit for myself? As opposed to during the Soviet era, it was all about Betterment for the good of the community as whole. Like that was the primary narrative around, like, wanting to succeed in life. And now it's about like, you know, and capitalism really is about that individual success. So it was, it taught me a lot, but, yeah, I lived for a year on the Tajik side, and the film that I made is about the relationship between the Tajik and Afghan relatives on the two sides of that border. That's so fascinating. I'm sure I can talk to you about that for hours, but for the sake of the podcast, we'll move forward. What I'm interested in exploring is, I mean, if I could recap what I think I've learned so far is you spend a lot of time trying to figure.

Unknown: 20:00

Out who you are, and all of these forces that were sort of shaping who you are, who you could be, the culture you've come from. And then you make a pivot into entrepreneurship, and then there's another pivot after that. So I kind of want to hear and I think our listeners will will appreciate this. Some of these things seem to have just kind of fallen in your lap, or you were working because of, like you said, are like, you know, random value systems you were working towards something that happened to serve you in this other purpose. And so, you know, almost by accident, you end up at Harvard. And I don't want to diminish, you know, how intelligent you are and how hard you actually did work, right? But it wasn't like you were striving to go to Harvard. You ended up there. And then, I'm sure something similar happened with your PhDs. Like, people don't just like, waltz into a PhD program, but it sounds like you did. And you know, beyond getting in, you also finished, which is, you know, no small feat, right? No, that was difficult. And then you you started a business, which is also a humongous undertaking. And I'm wondering where this drive has come from for you, and how you thought about at the time, or even now, looking back, these switches in direction, like the trajectory, like I'm sure when you were in your PhD program, you thought at some level you would become a professor totally. And then all of a sudden, you know, you you took a left turn. So tell us about that a little bit. Yeah, I don't think a left turn ever feels like a left turn in the moment, it feels like the natural next step. And I think that in hindsight, also when you're living it, you it just feels natural and makes sense. There's one other right turn, if we want to call it that, there is one other that that you miss, which is about like, eight years in the nonprofit sector community development. So yeah, and then a ton of countries as well. So I was really moving around a lot, which was so there was a lot of, a lot of shift up at the core of it all. So I'm gonna go back to my dad again, very, very core influence in my life. And he used to have the saying, you know, like, I remember when I called home and I'm like, Yeah, I was gonna be pre med at Harvard, and now I've decided to major in film production. I mean, take a lot of courses on Islamic Studies. And everyone was like, wait, what? You know, there's a lot of community pushback, like, are you really letting your daughter do that? And Dad's point to me was, you know, follow your heart and the money will follow. Follow your heart and the money will follow. Like, that was a line that I heard often the point where I internalized it very deeply, and at the core of that so the part that the money will follow, I later learned is not true. Later learn,

Aliaa Remtilla: 22:46

maybe a little bit the world is not economically just. So if your heart happens to not include the production of wealth as an explicit aim, it will not necessarily follow, right? Yeah, that has to be a part of what your goal is. But at the at the core, was okay. So if you have to, if what Dad's telling me is that I need to follow my heart, then at every step in the journey, I need to take that step back to ask myself, What does my heart want? And I think what I was when I when I looked at my parents, people in my parents generation, and many around me who had constraints in their life. When you have a constraint, when you are a migrant, when you are living in a context of political uncertainty, like my parents were in their generation, you don't have the luxury to follow your heart. You follow what is practical, or you choose to make the pursuit of wealth and creation of wealth for future generations, right, for stability, that is what your heart desires, right? So even if you are following your heart desires, it is not about the work itself, but it is about what the work can afford you and your family. And I think that as you grow older, that also comes in, right, regardless of who you are and how secure your life already is, that becomes part of what your heart desires. At the age of 1820, 25 even 30, without children, without a partner, what my heart desired was, you know, require deep exploration, and was often about work that felt fulfilling and meaningful to me and that challenged me personally, deeply challenged me that helped me grow and develop new skill sets. And so it's only logical if that is what my heart desired, that I would pursue one path, develop, acquire and master skills within that trajectory, and then shift trajectories so that I could further round those out, build them in a different direction.

Unknown: 25:00

Direction, feel challenged once again, and, you know, just become more fully me. And I think for me, that's life, right? There is no end, like it's life isn't perfect. Things happen to us, and we need to figure out how we we work within whatever gets placed. We were talking about 911 no control. It influences everything, right? It's just one, I mean, so many other different things coming your way, at a large scale, at a small scale, and then within that, it's this question of, How am I fully living my heart's desire, but also fully living what I want from this moment, and honestly, that's the bit that's never changed. That was a core skill that I acquired. And so yeah, sure, it might look like twists and turns, but it's just a deep, deep commitment to doing what my heart desires, and then having the confidence that if I desire, whatever I desire, I will do, I can do, and I will excel at. I love that so much. It was not my experience. I wish it were I didn't have, like, a guiding heuristic, which did sound like you really did. You know I can look back at the twist and turn in my life and understand, maybe subconsciously, what I was trying to move towards. And now that I have, you know, done the work to really understand what I think my heart's desire is and what my hopefully, my purpose is the thing that keeps driving me forward. I can put that on, you know, the pivots that I made over the course of my life and make it all make sense. But I know that I am, you know, doing the hindsight is 2020. Thing I love that you had a core value and a practice of stepping back and interrogating yourself and your environment and your work to continually stay on the path and stay in alignment with yourself. I think that is so admirable, so impressive, and it is really what I hope for so many young people who are concerned about maybe the exterior appearance of a straight line rather than an internal straight line, like, Oh my gosh. So this brings me to something that you we were chatting about before I turned on the recording, that you're kind of like taking taking it easy in December. You're not really chasing anything, and you know, you're letting you know if things come to you, they come to you, but you're really just taking some time for yourself. And that is something that I still struggle to hold space for in my life, and I know that that is something that is probably taking you some some work, even though you you did have this Heart's Desire thing you know from the start. And I also know that this is something that you help other people with, maybe not this exact challenge, but these sorts of challenges. So talk to us about that pivot into your coaching life and how your own journey has influenced how you coach. Yeah, so this, this deep question of, what is it that I really want for myself? I did a lot of youth work at one stage in my career with with 18 to 25 year olds to work on this, like, who am I? Kind of question, right? One of the things that I've realized more recently through my startup career is that as I was engaging with folks, you know, who are in their 30s, 40s, 50s, that kind of work, that deeper question of, who am I and what do I want for myself? It doesn't stop it's not a one and done, right? Like we need to keep answering that question. And I think that when, when folks get married, have children, and then are trying to balance that. Now my identity is not only defined, especially for high achievers, right? So my coaching work works specifically with high achievers, and for those of us who are both, I think we can both fit into that general category for people who are trying to achieve at a very high level. So much of my identity, at least, was wrapped up in what I was doing professionally, right? So my professional career divided my identity, and then I think there become these other layers of identity that get layered on top. We were talking about intersectionality earlier, right? And as a kid, it's like, okay, well, I am a daughter, or I am a son, or am I a child? I am a grandchild, I am a cousin, I am a friend. I have all of these kind of other responsibilities that just don't seem as front and center as professional. And then when people get married, becoming a spouse, or even just having a partner without the formality of marriage, becoming a parent, these are the types of responsibilities, ways of being that that we.

Aliaa Remtilla: 30:00

We want to really dig deep and then becoming a caregiver for aging parents, right? So there's, there's so much involved, and we're at the beak of our career. So how does that all get balanced? And how, and for me, at the core, like there's so much discussion, sometimes this often comes to, like, the guilt. It comes down to this feeling of guilt for not being able to do everything properly, or the way that I want to be doing it, having to say no, feeling okay with saying no. For me, I think that's all the outward manifestation of a core inner challenge, which is that I haven't yet figured out what I want for myself. So the outside noise, outside expectations are amorphously experienced, but not pinned down and defined. And a lot of the work that I help folks do is to peel back all of that and do that inner work that I've been doing since I was a child, and sort of bringing that what is at the core of my way of living in the world, supporting each of my clients in a way that is super specific and tailored to them and their way of being to do that work for themselves in that moment of their life, and figure out, okay, I kind of knew who I was, but let me actually reground and re ask this question, and to your point, so, so that's, that's the coaching work. And to your question around like taking December easy, you're right. It's not easy. It's just, it's what do I want right now? So when I've asked myself that question at the moment, what is it that I truly desire? What does my heart tell me that I need right now? My heart tells me I need to figure out how to be and it's just where I'm really like this is super vulnerably personally sharing. I'm at a place in my journey where I think so much of being an achiever is looking to the future and so orienting our present towards the attainment we can whatever it is that we're trying to attain in the future. The reality is we live in a present. And one of the things that I'm working on very, very explicitly at the moment is, what is that? What does it mean to be to surrender into the present? I have goosebumps. Listeners, you can't see this, but I'm holding up a post it note

Sheila Akbar: 32:31

I keep on my computer. This is the thing that I'm working on. I also work with coach, and one of the things that we are working on is moving from the idea of taking space for myself is like everybody just leave me alone. Shifting that from like I just want to be, I just want to be, and the thing that I want to be is going to fill up all that space. And sort of like you were saying, it's not going to require me to say no to this, or think carefully if I'm going to take on this responsibility, my life is going to be so full of what I want it to be, that that's not even a question. I love that so much. Gosh, we all have so much we can learn from you. I'm really glad you came and decided to vulnerably share all of that. It is really hard work, and I think the work gets easier in community, whether that's, you know, one on one, or with other people who share our values or who can hold space for our goals when we can't hold them for ourselves? So yeah, thank you. Thank you so much for being part of my community. This is great. Thanks for the conversation. Of course, I think this is a great place to leave it. I've taken up so much of your time, but like I said, I'm sure I could talk to you about a lot of these things. I would love to watch your your film, your dissertation film, yeah, some point you should share that with me. Yeah. We'll turn off the recording in a second. But before I let you go, I have a very good friend who finished her PhD in Social I want to say it's social anthropology from the new school. And she finished in 2016 I want to say, and she worked on the concept of charity.

Unknown: 34:04

Basically, charity is white supremacy in Islamic giving, and I think you guys would really love each other, so I will introduce you to her as well. Okay, back to the podcast. Thank you again. This was a really wonderful conversation. If people want to learn more about the work you do, how to maybe be coached by you, or just, you know, hear more of your wisdom, these little pearls of wisdom that you keep dropping. How can they do that? Easiest ways just to connect with me or send me a message on LinkedIn. I think that's like, super, super easy. Otherwise, also, I have, I have a website. My film is actually on my website. So, oh, great. You want to see the website? It's just aliarola.com I'll make sure both of those are linked in the show notes. Awesome. Sounds good? Okay, thank you again. Yay. Thank you.

Sheila Akbar: 34:54

Well, there you have it. Hope you enjoyed that conversation. There was a lot we had to leave on the cutting room floor, just for length, but it was super interesting, and I really do encourage you to check out her website and follow her on LinkedIn. And as we wind down the year here, I do want to let you know we will be on a break until mid January, and then we will be back. And like I've teased previously, we will be switching up the format a little bit here some live coaching. We'll do a lot of Q and A sessions, and then every once in a while, we will have some traditional sort of interview style sessions as well. And I hope that that is all very interesting and helpful for all of you. If you have a question that you would like to have answered on air by me or one of my teammates, please submit it to us. You can find the links in the show notes, or you can email us at info, at signeteducation.com, and happy new year everybody. We'll see you next time.